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| i can't afford new toys anymore http://skullbrain.org/legacy/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=26029 |
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| Author: | pickleloaf [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | i can't afford new toys anymore |
seems like the prices continue to rise i can't afford much of anything right now, but especially no new standard sized vinyls it seems. nothing below 100 bucks i'm glad i can still find the occasional forgotten vintage piece to satisfy any craving |
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| Author: | ---NT--- [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 11:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
I here ya! If I'm spending $100+ it'll only be for a Bemon. It's a shame, there's some cool stuff out there I'd like to get. But I think those Death Phantom suits will probably be the last things I buy for a while, unless I sell some stuff and get a positive PayPal balance. |
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| Author: | Lixx [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 12:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
100% with you on that! I just paid my last celga balance and shipping invoice this morning and that's it from me for awhile. Only using money from record sales to buy anything for a few months and that's pretty much come to a standstill with no sales in 2 weeks. With this crap economy, powerful yen, weak dollar, possible lay off's, and xmas coming up- I need to just appreciate what I have for a few months. I'm just going to live vicariously through watching YJA auctions and others that "show their collection". |
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| Author: | Roger [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Good. Buy my shit! |
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| Author: | andy [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 6:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Factories in Japan work on a 3 month pricing cycle for vinyl, and costs are still just about higher than ever. So even though oil has plummeted, we're still seeing $100+/barrel prices affecting base material costs. In a perfect world, come the next cycle, the factories should lower their prices to reflect lower ppb costs. Yet, apparently prices come down much much slower than they go up, so sofubi makers are still getting slammed by high production costs. The secod bogeyman is the yen, which is stubbornly refusing to break 100/1 USD. That's the next thing that could send costs up even higher. But yeah I think a lot of collectors look at $100 or more for a new figure and think long and hard before making the purchase. Personally, that's what's kept me from buying excellent figures like the new Ojo Rojo releases. |
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| Author: | abelincolnjr [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 6:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Word Andy, $100 midsize figures are unfortunately off the buying block, shit $100 standard size figures are off the block at this point. Sadly it seems waiting around a few cycles for new figs on YJA is the best way to go. I jsut saw that marmit robot guy from last summer on yja sealed for 2000 yen. |
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| Author: | andy [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Exactly, and the nearly instant fall in "value" of most new toys is causing people to hold off on paying retail for new figures. That causes demand to fall, which hurts vinyl makers and sellers and generally brings things down even further. Vicious cycle. |
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| Author: | abelincolnjr [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Although we over here in the west,were up until recently a rabid purchasers, arent we considered Grey Market? As such do we affect the Sofubi market in Japan? Mori has said in an interview in the past that they dont really consider the west when making toys. (I imagine that couldve changed since this was pre mini and RxH uberhype) but Ive also read (on Skullbrain) that all the new sofubi toys are basically earmarked collectors outside of japan since the demand there inst all that grand. Being a New Yorker I have no idea but any light you can shed on the big picture would be welcome. |
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| Author: | andy [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 8:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
I haven't got the breakdown, but it's been suggested before that the majority of so-called "pachi sofubi" (read: indie or "original" Japanese toys) collectors are outside of Japan. But it's also clear that there are a number of hardcore collectors in Japan, for Real Head, Secret Base, and others. I'd say the demand for sofubi in the West has had a huge impact on production decisions, particularly in terms of production numbers. Unfortunately, that may be one of the major factors in this problem we're discussing. Since the pure show "exclusive" is an endangered species, and standard production numbers are high compared to the number of collectors, collectors are looking at this as a "buyers market" and are buying with less urgency, for lack of a better word. Why get worked up about a release when it will be so easy to get later (and for less!) That sort of thing. Exceptions to the rule like the Bogeymen and other short-run figures show how important production numbers are in stoking collector interest and maintaining high levels of demand (particularly when the SRP is already very high compared to mass produced toys). At the end of the day, cranked up prod. numbers seem to be leading to some heavy inventory pressure and even deadstock, which is about the last thing any store or sofubi maker wants. |
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| Author: | melek_taus [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 9:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Funny. Many were pushing for higher production #'s so the figures would be attainable. But now that the figs are easier to get, and people can hold off on them for a bit, they lose interest and the figs don't sell. Which makes a strong case for small production runs. |
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| Author: | andy [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Yep. and that`s why vinyl makers should go their own way in terms of decision making and not pay quite so much attention to collector demands, which are often all too whimsical. High prices + high volume + crappy economy + strong yen = bad sofocombo |
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| Author: | UnderBeit [ Wed Nov 05, 2008 11:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
pickleloaf wrote: seems like the prices continue to rise i can't afford much of anything right now, but especially no new standard sized vinyls it seems. nothing below 100 bucks i'm glad i can still find the occasional forgotten vintage piece to satisfy any craving It's kinda disheartening. ANd when I finally scrape up $130 or so (the price of a standard sized plus shipping/tax) I can't choose just one, so I wind up frittering it away on the For Sale thread or ebay on a couple minis or whatnot. |
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| Author: | Collin Shots [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 12:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
Its a double edged sword. After being only able to get one pumpkin mask SB fig then getting the balzac head, which I hate, and missing out on some base figures it is really hard for me to keep buying any at all. I get what tinman said about it occupying too much time. Do I want a figure readily available from a line I collect, or a shot a securing a "rare" one that sells fast. I have been quite mad that I bought some at retail to later see them for 35 bucks too. |
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| Author: | abelincolnjr [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
So the question is this: If Marmit, for instance, is selling a new figure for 6000 yen, then how does it wind up being $100 by the time we get a chance to get a crack at it? I can see the overhead for super7 bringing over small shipments frequently and paying customs etc. will cost a whole hell of a lot so I get why an American company has to charge a lot more than Japanese retail to get the stuff in stock. Its a business not a favor. But then at the same time Kaiju Taro for instance sells the same figures for the same price. Do the sofubi makers not do wholesale prices? And I'm talking Marmit and M1 and the larger toy companies. Obviously Bemon isnt going to be able to crank out numbers big enough to give a price break. |
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| Author: | KJB [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 6:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
I'm very glad that I made a decision at the start of the year to be more selective in my buying habits. As everyone knows, it's easy to fall into the trap of "OMG! Gotta have it!", but the increasing lack of space in my apartment, combined with the fact that I was digging myself a huge hole credit-wise, meant that I began to think much harder before making a purchase. I see a lot of new things that are kind of interesting, but I almost always force myself to wait a day (if not more) before making the leap; and more often than not I end up passing. In regard to production numbers, I agree that no one wants to have dead stock lying around, but I still maintain that making less than 10 of something is playing to impulse buyers and flippers, and frequently leaves the average collector out of the running (not a popular opinion, I know). |
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| Author: | Lixx [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
OK I know I said before that when the trooper hype was in full swing why doesn't Toygraph just make a bigger run to avoid huge secondary market mark ups? Well I don't think they ever really made larger runs but they did seem to start cranking 2 new troopers out a week and that's really saturated the market bringing pricing way way down. Which makes some people unhappy. It's a bit of a paradox really. Readily available for everyone = low price, but something anyone can own. Everyone's bitter. Ridiculously low production number= super high price flipper central. Everyone's bitter. We toys geeks are a fickle lot aren't we? I agree with Abe though. Are the majors (Marmit, M1 etc) really not offering these toys at a wholesale retailer discount? Seems like they may be shooting themselves in the foot especially with this economy. Some may argue production costs but seriously when you've been in business that long you know where to go to get shit done in a not so costly way. When you're banking that hard at some of these direct to the distributer costs I kind of don't feel sorry for the companies. |
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| Author: | hillsy11 [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
M1go is really not that big in terms of company size. Roger can chime in with more accurate info, but I belive it's just a handful of people. I think you guys are REALLY underestimating the cost of production on these toys, in general. And K-T charges what he charges because he CAN. |
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| Author: | Lixx [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
hillsy11 wrote: M1go is really not that big in terms of company size. Roger can chime in with more accurate info, but I belive it's just a handful of people. I think you guys are REALLY underestimating the cost of production on these toys, in general. And K-T charges what he charges because he CAN. I agree with ya hillsy on the M1go. I should have really thought about that before I wrote it. I should have known better because I submitted the video of Dennis @ M1go! Marmit though is a pretty big company. |
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| Author: | atease [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
abelincolnjr wrote: So the question is this: If Marmit, for instance, is selling a new figure for 6000 yen, then how does it wind up being $100 by the time we get a chance to get a crack at it? I can see the overhead for super7 bringing over small shipments frequently and paying customs etc. will cost a whole hell of a lot so I get why an American company has to charge a lot more than Japanese retail to get the stuff in stock. Its a business not a favor. But then at the same time Kaiju Taro for instance sells the same figures for the same price. Do the sofubi makers not do wholesale prices? And I'm talking Marmit and M1 and the larger toy companies. Obviously Bemon isnt going to be able to crank out numbers big enough to give a price break. Bemon at retail is a fair price for the product that you're receiving. It's a one (or two if you include the shop) person operation for the most part and paying $150 for a figure that is limited to 30 or less seems ok in my opinion. Most of us would never see a bemon for this price so that might be where some frustration comes in. hillsy you're right. Kt can charge those prices because people continue to pay them, but also costs involved with running a business. He may have employees he needs to pay, warehouse space to rent, transportation costs, and the list could go on. Ultimately, it's the business owner who sets the prices. If demand is high enough, the prices will correlate with the demand. Flood the market, prices go down, but like andy mentioned, the worst thing these companies want is deadstock sitting around. Look at the recent sale super 7 just had. The ilanena sets as one example were priced here at $70-75 when they came out and they were more than half off. That's a big loss for a small company. While it would be awesome to pay Japan retail for toys that come out, it's unrealistic. There are just too many costs involved. The one thing I will say about this "not being able to afford toys" business for a lot of us is that it's nice to see it all calming down a bit. Watching people salivate after (in my opinion) crappy toys and everyone chiming in with "+1"s as far as wanting new figures gets really boring all of the time...it's nice to see people having to make decisions and not buying up 100 toys in a month. While there is nothing wrong with this, it ends up with a lot of people dumping their toys in the BST a week after they get them for half the cost, therefore undermining the prices we pay for the toys at retail. While it's nice to give deals to folks, it's also ridiculous to think people being Robin Hood so to speak is "RFSO" or required these days in order to run a sale. My two cents...sorry for the ramble. |
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| Author: | plover [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 9:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
http://www.channel4.com/culture/microsi ... gtime.html |
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| Author: | kichigai [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
plover that video was brilliant & so relevant to the blind consumer want to fill to need in us all. the end was hardcore, it left me happy & sad thanks so much for posting that. where can i see more? |
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| Author: | abelincolnjr [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
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| Author: | plover [ Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
kichigai wrote: plover that video was brilliant & so relevant to the blind consumer want to fill to need in us all. the end was hardcore, it left me happy & sad thanks so much for posting that. where can i see more? Glad you liked it. More from this on going series here - http://www.channel4.com/culture/microsites/M/mesh/ |
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| Author: | toybotstudios [ Fri Nov 07, 2008 1:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
haha. so friggin true. i dont' even get to the playing part. straight to the plastic tub.... |
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| Author: | Kevlo9 [ Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: i can't afford new toys anymore |
I wish I could play pong against my Ojo! |
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