Kevlo9, is that you? So, the wires that come from the bottom... what's the reasoning for them?

hehe, well not that extreme, just with 5 hooks on my back, it seems like its the most common and "beginner" position

I think this shit is dumb.

How constructive.

4 years ago here in Portland I did a ten point facing down, with 8 hooks in my back and 2 in each leg, which was presented to me as the standard beginner's position. Despite liking mods and such, I am not at all active in the piercing community, and found the event to be really sceney and unappealing. I wanted more of a personal ritualistic experience (which I have had in intentional group settings in other communities), but there was only space for exhibitionism as far as I observed, and crass exhibitionism at that. I was glad I could check it off of my to-do list, but overall it was a lackluster experience. Really you just hang there and swing around a bit. Maybe I'll do a Sun Dance one day.

My quesions are:

Do you end up with big honkin scars on your body from doing this?
Do they stick the hooks through muscle tissue? I would think just skin would rip.

I don't have a tattoo or hole in my body, so this is for sure purely curiosity!

I learned from watching you.

My quesions are:

Do you end up with big honkin scars on your body from doing this?
Do they stick the hooks through muscle tissue? I would think just skin would rip.

I don't have a tattoo or hole in my body, so this is for sure purely curiosity!

Perhaps, but I'm not a hypocrite.

]

If I recall correctly, hooks don't just pierce skin, they actually go beneath musculature such that the body is actually hanging from muscle, not skin.

The practice originated as part of the Native American Sun Dance ritual of some tribes. It was explored by non-native persons as a sort of underground experiential trip. Public awareness increased in the late 1980s concurrent with the boom in tattooing and body piercing.

Because this thread piqued my curiosity (and because I've been out of touch with this sort of thing since the mid-90s) I did a bit of research. I mean no offense to anyone else who is practicing it or interested, but I can't help but think that this business of doing it as a "show" in a public context is complete B.S. and frankly a little offensive, given the spiritual NDN origin. I can appreciate non-native interest but again, doing it as a freak show sort of thing is really lame and shallow in my opinion. A private ceremony would be something else. The original non-native explorers of this sort of thing didn't intend a for-show spectacle at all.

I think its so far removed from the original aspect that at this point, and in any of the modern primitive/body mod/industrial scenes I've seen it that it really isn't disrespect or any removal.

Good point and a fair rebuttal. I'm kinda laughing at my own attitude here, because I helped Vale and Andrea promote "Modern Primitives," thought Fakir was a nice chap and was pierced by Jim Ward (during an aftershock of the Loma Prieta quake LOL.) Although I had my own personal ideas about a spiritual connection to things done back then, there were never any delusions of "going tribal" or getting in touch with my Cherokee roots. Maybe I just need to lighten up. Get into toys or something.

Jeez I remember when Fakir Musafar and Jim Ward were the only people doing this, claiming that it yielded a spiritually-oriented body high. Long time ago. Then along came Re/Search's "Modern Primitives" and now people are doing it for audiences? I dunno... Seems like the original contexts are lost if it's just sort of a sideshow, but maybe I'm missing the point?

I worked with Stelarc in college, he had already moved on to totally different stuff by then...but I think this really is an outdated/overdone thing. it was shocking when he did it, but now it's just sort of silly - no?