Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju

Discussion in 'Japan Toys' started by chimply.kaiju, Aug 18, 2011.

  1. bunnyboy

    bunnyboy Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,980
    Location:
    germanymey
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    I'll hold my final judgment until the price tag is revealed... :razz:

    And technically I would agree with what you and @JoeMan have said; but disrespect or not aside, even if whoever made this dreamt of making a toy *cough* "based on" *cough* Black Ace their whole life, the fact that him/her/whatevs chose to do it AFTER the most-hyped dollmaker already put his version out just reeks of opportunistic hype-mongering to me. Technically one could make a knock-off their "own" version of Hirota-san's father's original Ju or Splurrt's Cinema Monster and nobody could do shit about it due to the generally bootleggy history of homages in character design (for lack of more precise words), I guess - it would still be a dick move though.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2018
  2. Mr. Humphreys

    Mr. Humphreys S7 Royalty

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2008
    Messages:
    3,406
    Location:
    Land of Plush
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    They look like they're wearing roller skates :)
    But I'm not about to cough up an annual payment in property taxes!
     
  3. animator

    animator Mr. Freshly Smacked Ass Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2008
    Messages:
    5,365
    Location:
    Hollywood
    Name:
    David
    Instagram:
    davidjcoffman
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Was just about to post something similar. Well said. The timing, and it being an obscure toy to reference make the argument more difficult that they had this idea on their own. That said, I think he's a cute little guy.

     
    wingnut0 and Madmax405 like this.
  4. Madmax405

    Madmax405 Toy Prince

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2018
    Messages:
    206
    Location:
    NYC
    Name:
    Max
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Cannot unsee
     
    Mr. Humphreys likes this.
  5. Michael Beverage

    Michael Beverage Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages:
    1,525
    Location:
    The Dirty South
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    @animator I agree I think it’s probably a safe assumption they did not have this idea on their own.

    @bunnyboy *cough* I’m sorry *cough* .......what were we talking about? *cough* :D
     
  6. bunnyboy

    bunnyboy Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,980
    Location:
    germanymey
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Well something, obviously!

    [​IMG]
     
    Michael Beverage and ultrakaiju like this.
  7. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    私は尋ねた:

    あなたはヴィンテージBullmark Gigantor minisをエミュレートするために、ベルトを意図的にペイントしましたか?

    彼は答えました:

    はい。その時から私は好きだった。

    ミニサイズ私は外で遊んだり、冒険をしたりしました。私は気にしなかったし、本当にペイントが "厄介な"ものであることに気付かなかった。

    今では、それぞれのヴィンテージが他のすべてのものと同じではないという魅力を実際に与えています。

    目、角、歯などはすべて違う

    私は言った:
    私は、現代のファンがそれを理解したり気にかけたりしないと思う。
    このようなあなたからの他の作品を見ることを願っています!

    再度、感謝します。

    彼は言った:
    ようこそ。
     
  8. bunnyboy

    bunnyboy Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,980
    Location:
    germanymey
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    @kichigai Interesting! Although making a paintjob intentionally sloppy to emulate, well, sloppy workmanship is definitely taking nostalgia a bit too far for my personal liking/OCD... :lol:
     
    ultrakaiju likes this.
  9. badteethcomics

    badteethcomics Side Dealer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,284
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    Name:
    Glenn
    Instagram:
    badteethcomics
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    What would really be great is if they emulated the factory-run Bullmark paint slaps onto some original non-hyped characters. We all know that HxS took the design from an old model kit, but the thing is HxS used his own discretion and taste to choose that particular kit to update in his style. There are a lot of vintage model kits out there that nobody has ven touched.. if you can't come up with your own ideas, at least do a little bit of fucking independent research and swipe a design that's long forgotten.
     
  10. Waterbear

    Waterbear Comment King

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2013
    Messages:
    1,222
    Location:
    Hiding in your toy chest
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    These days it's pretty much impossible to tell if someone is copying another toy or using the same inspiration another toy maker used or if it's a combination of both. Bootlegs of bootlegs of bootlegs. It doesn't really bother me though. When I see a new toy I care less about what inspired it and more about how much I like it and how well it's been sculpted and how reasonably it's priced. Looking at my own collection I see more MaBa inspired stuff than anything else. I probably have 5X as many bootleg maba toys than I do actual MaBa toys because of the price and availability. When an artist I like does something MaBa inspired I love it. Hell, I am totally guilty of working on my own toy inspired by my all time favorite bootlegs of MaBa stuff right now. Will it upset some people? Probably. It is a toy I've always wanted to make? Hell yes. Been working on it for about 5 years.

    I know several popular toy makers who used to get PISSED about stuff that seemed to bite their own designs/styles but most of them get over it after a few years of toy making. They realize it's just part of how things work and getting mad about it is pointless. All you can do is keep making cool shit and letting people who can't come up with their own thing follow your breadcrumbs.
     
    shincartoon and Madmax405 like this.
  11. bunnyboy

    bunnyboy Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,980
    Location:
    germanymey
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    @Waterbear I respectfully disagree. Although it was just a fascination with those weird toys (and Pushead) that brought me here, I stayed for the endless wealth of pop-cultural references hidden in these toys.

    The first proper Japanese toy I bought was a Death Menargo, and even though already lurking on Skullbrain for about half a year and being familiar with the practice of toys referencing older toys or artwork in more or less obvious ways, my mind was still blown when I found out that it was based on poor old Namegon. Because I had thought "Okay, THIS is so far fucking out that it HAS to be completely original."

    So from that point on, I've always been fascinated with the inspiration behind, in particular, Japanese toys. Just look at someone like Shelterbank: Surely you can enjoy the toys on their own merits, but that unique Japanese style of referencing/making an homage to a particular character/toy while creating something unique and original in the process is such a huge part of the overall aesthetic that I just feel you're missing out on part of the toy's story when you don't get that. Learning the history behind the Gorilla Ju didn't make me want one, but it made me appreciate what Hirota-san is doing and why he is making toys in the first place...
     
    shincartoon and Waterbear like this.
  12. Waterbear

    Waterbear Comment King

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2013
    Messages:
    1,222
    Location:
    Hiding in your toy chest
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju

    I understand what you're saying and I respect it. The big difference though is your knowledge base of all these wacky toys is so much bigger than mine and probably everyone who isn't on SB at all. So your appreciation level is just better. A lot of that knowledge doesn't even seem obtainable anymore. When I first got here 5 years ago I spent months just sifting through old threads and even at that point so much of the discussion was really hard to follow because of broken links and removed images. Today it's several times worse with countless pages of discussions about pictures of toys that just no longer exist on skullbrain. These days people seem hesitant to share or discuss any toy here at all for fear of making then unobtainable or inspiring the next copycat I suppose. Add to that the fact that most toy makers don't share their inspirations with the general public it gets more and more difficult to know anything about new toys. Plus the new crop of makers who not only hide where their stuff is made but by who and how and why as well. Some of my favorite old discussions here where when all you guys teamed up to figure out what inspired what(like the first few pages of the SHB B movie monsters thread)but that just doesn't seem to happen anymore. It's understandable but I still miss that stuff.
     
    Russblue11, shincartoon and bunnyboy like this.
  13. bunnyboy

    bunnyboy Line of Credit

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2008
    Messages:
    1,980
    Location:
    germanymey
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    @Waterbear I still feel I don't know shit about Japanese toys, especially compared to some of the more focused collectors and vintage heads on here - but hey, despite completely agreeing with everything else you wrote, I still feel part of the fun is that you learn something new almost everyday. Kinda like piecing together a big puzzle...
     
    Waterbear likes this.
  14. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    While not on topic, it's still toytalk...

    @bunnyboy the menargo head is attributed to a late 1950's Japanese Halloween skeleton puppet. I have been meaning to post pics of my puppets in context of the Longneck doll. At some point I hope to have free time to do that.

    I know I am in a minority here but HXS as a brand is disappointing in that fans exploited it to the point that the maker increased his prices. I am hoping his involvement with Bullmark will allow more folks to enjoy his work without the BS.

    I do not get the outrage over the mini robots and find them kinda cute in a vintage novelty kinda way. The toy scene seems to be increasingly drifting to a "show off" mentality with actual fans being in a minority. Which we always were.

    The toys should make folks happy.

    I use IG but rarely look at IG as it gives me a headache to look at a phone for more than ten minutes at a time. Nothing to do with BS trite begging of fools. That can be avoided by just not reading.

    It's thrilling to see HXS give Brutal A the Henshin Cyborg treatment but know in advance the retail will be a month of my rent so a moot point to get too excited.

    At least I hope the deep pockets fans are happy rather than trophy hunters. Most of the ones I have met are jerks with very few exceptions.
     
  15. deafmetal

    deafmetal Addicted

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2016
    Messages:
    754
    Name:
    Mark
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Agreed! I really enjoyed reading through all the research and seeing the original film monster photos in that thread. Less Instagram, more Skullbrain, please.
     
  16. badteethcomics

    badteethcomics Side Dealer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,284
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    Name:
    Glenn
    Instagram:
    badteethcomics
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    You're right - at this stage it's pretty much impossible to see a new toy without some kind of obvious tribute in it's design.. just a natural result of everything being so easily seen thanks to this new thing called the internet don't know if you've heard of it. It's not purely about hating on people who use other toys/characters as an influence - as an example, you don't see anybody complaining about Violence Toy doing cool Puppet Master/Basketcase toys. You can tell that these guys are fans and are making the toys for themselves first and not to make a quick buck.

    It's about these culture vultures swooping in and jacking designs once they get a bit of hype.

    Even if they put a little creativity/humor into swiping a hyped toy design like Target Earth/Butanohana (yes, we all know Buta are licensed - stylistically it's a good example) then that would make this newjack phenomenon so much easier to digest.
     
  17. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju


    @badteethcomics

    Is it the perception of laziness that bugs you or the actual toys themselves which create ire? I would love one of these goofy little bastards. However, it would depend on the price. To me they are a $25 - $45 Max and it would be super dumb if they are say, over twice that.

    On a side note the OG model kit looks very very different than the box art. Nearly wonky by comparison. I find it interesting in seeing others interpretations of the material and think each version has it's merits.
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2018
  18. badteethcomics

    badteethcomics Side Dealer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,284
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    Name:
    Glenn
    Instagram:
    badteethcomics
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    @kichigai it's both, but primarily the though process behind it... this is how I imagine the artist's process would have gone:

    "man that Hirota guy sure does get a lot of likes and reposts and money money money..."
    "I wonder how I can do the same?"
    "I can't think of anything cool to make.. why is this so hard"
    "I keep getting distracted by Yeezys and Off White.. back to my 'hard' work"
    "Hmmm how can I make it in the sofubi kaiju scene"
    "Wait a minute.. hold up.. eureka!!"
    "If I want to be as popular as Hirota.. maybe I can... be Hirota"
    "I've seen my friends at Vintage Vinyl Club ripoff a hundred toys.. it is the true way to succeed!!"
    "Hmmm making a big large toy is very expensive.. too much materials"
    "What do you mean you have to pay for tooling to make sofubi?!?!"
    "Hmm resin is quick and simple..."
    "Wait.. I saw Hirota make mini size version of his figures.. but, silly guy didn't make a mini Brutal Ace.. what a fool"
    "To be true OG.. you gotta be old school baby.. so I will paint my toy in a messy old school style"
    "Hahaha everybody will love my pocket sized creation!!"
    "I will be the true star of instagram now #want #need"
     
    shincartoon, jhsu and IronPaw like this.
  19. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    I see.. Why speculate to such a degree and not just personally ask the folks making the items?

    It seems like the preception you have is only such from not asking questions directly to the points.
     
  20. badteethcomics

    badteethcomics Side Dealer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,284
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    Name:
    Glenn
    Instagram:
    badteethcomics
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    There is no possible way they decided to make this without being influenced by Hirota and his success. No way whatsoever is anything else the driving force behind this release.. @kichigai
     
    IronPaw likes this.
  21. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    There was a mini resin made in Japan based on the vintage model kit several years prior to the HXS doll.

    It's closer to what the actual vintage kit looks like. I will try and dig out a photo of the material in a few days.

    Same guy also made Samson mini, Hedoro and the other two pollution monsters.

    They were just Garage kits but nice.
     
    badteethcomics likes this.
  22. badteethcomics

    badteethcomics Side Dealer

    Joined:
    May 31, 2013
    Messages:
    2,284
    Location:
    Brisbane, Australia
    Name:
    Glenn
    Instagram:
    badteethcomics
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    And that's completely fine - good for that guy because he made them when the character wasn't one of the current want/need hyped toys. It's not about dissing people who make their own versions of existing characters - that's why I have no beef with Leo making his Idol Monster or Terrible Whore making a rad Kinnukiman figure (to repeat a point I made earlier). The issue is the hypebeast makers pulling shit like this mini Brutal Ace.
     
  23. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    “Hype is over/ If you want it”
     
  24. Anti Social Andy

    Anti Social Andy Die-Cast

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2006
    Messages:
    8,895
    Location:
    The Grim North
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Oh the irony of these being bite-size!
     
    bunnyboy and badteethcomics like this.
  25. kichigai

    kichigai Side Dealer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,075
    Location:
    モンスタ
    Hirota Saigansho: Gorilla-ju, Mecha Gorilla-ju, & Tyranno-ju
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2018

Share This Page