Kozik rips off Charles Krafft...

intent and meaning aside, i'd say you were just too lazy to draw your own logo.

 

And that's going to be my last post on this topic. I've got actual things to do. I wish had the free time to go back & forth with you guys. But sadly I actually have a real life.

 

promise?!?

 

My head hurts..

 

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/0tQ19tAw6h0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

So how much more of a fuck less could you give?

 

Wow, I missed the juiciest bit. As far as I'm concerned, this is not an obvious mash-up of two images that have a "loaded meaning", but a sneaky way to hide some lesser known Nazi imagery (especially since it was slightly altered). Anyway, now that we've established this is actually a Wehrmacht skull I would love to learn what the "88" part speaks about, please.

Considering how old those pieces are, one might be led to assume that it's actually Krafft that's ripping off Kozik..?!? This thread confuses the living fuck out of me.

 

Ugh.

 

88 = HH = Heil Hitler like SS = Shultz Staffel......

 

yeah...the 88...double ugh. and my head also hurts (from laughing @ ungawa222's post)
I love you guys.

 

Probably should have put that in blue/purple? I was just poking fun at what this thread was originally about.

 

^^ Don't worry. Not. Serious. At. All.

What I meant is that I would love to hear the "artistic" "reasoning" behind using the 88 in conjunction with Nazi imagery. And it's actually "Schutzstaffel", although I much prefer "Schultzstaffel"...

 

Well, it's too bad, S&S 88, that you're done posting in this thread, because the response my post spurred from you was very interesting. Man, speaking for myself, I am not trying to personally attack you or your brand- just offering my own opinion as one art-damaged toy nerd... just some food for thought.

My guess is that you'll still read this thread, so I'll go ahead and comment on your last post with no expectation of an answer. Let's start with a couple lines from the end:

So here you seem to say that the pure graphic is the point... you just wanted a skull in a headdress for the logo. Well, then why not just draw an original skull in a headdress, or engage an artist to do that?

"Work best" here seems to translate to easiest- most graphically compatible for a digital mash accomplished in under an hour.

But both of these lines are preceded by:

So which really came first, the chicken or the symbolic weight? Did it happen that you found these great, convenient graphics to use, but they both (one in particular) come pretty loaded... so you retrofit an intent/statement onto it that dovetails nicely with the brand's concept? I don't know man- smells like wanting to have it both ways, to me. And when you chase the acknowledgement above that yes, you are aware of the weight and power of these graphic elements, and yes, it was your intent to tap into that power ("adding fuel" to paraphrase you)... with this:

Well, I'm sorry, but you're well out of your depth. You're employing heavyweight symbols for a lightweight, barely coherent concept/commentary. And what this is all in service to, ultimately, is a clothing brand.

You want graphic power and weight for your stuff? Try designing something original that has those qualities. This board is full of inspiration in that direction, much of it from members. When in doubt, go Mishka and Put A Monster On It. Works for them!

 

Or..." Put a bird on it." ; )

 

I have this toy. The back story is, if not plausible, interesting.

 

Exactly what was on my mind, Ralph!

 

Well the appropriate bird might be one without feathers. ; )

Joking aside I think a lot of folks like Lorne, NT and Ungawa pointed out how dogmatic your arguments and rational were S&S 88. And your moniker, as someone pointed out, put you in a grave you can't dig out of.

 

Haha, this thread is priceless. Thanks for making me laugh while eating my lunch.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIAVFbOI4-o

I've eaten handfulls of mushrooms that were less of a trip than this whole mess, normally I might be inclined to take offense to stuff like this but maaaaaan I need the laugh so popcorn me and que up the asshat

 

Regardless, I feel Fremdscham anytime someone tries to pull off a brand from something as tried and poor in impact and taste as murder, genocide and some contorted idea of 'high-life'.


Sometimes I am very happy I only wear tacky death metal tees.

Totally agree, the Koziks of street wear, amirite!?

 

Lamour Supreme is doing graphics for this guy now.

 

S&S has the least defensible argument ever on SB. Having worked with the prison system I can tell you there is no mistaking the 88, at least not here on the west coast, for precisely what it is. You going walking around with that on a shirt or tattooed on your arm and your making a statement, a very plain statement. Same with a board name. It feels like he's trying to sneak it under the wire for those that wouldn't notice. It would be like saying my name is XIV, uh' I just like roman numerals. As for the skull. Sorry but many of you are off base. There is no such thing as a Wehrmacht skull. Didnt exist. There certainly are two primary versions of the SS skull. Neither of which look like this. Certainly no helmeted version. He borrowed that from a fantasy image more associated with bikers than Germans. Same with the S&S moniker, its a motorcycle motor maker, and you guessed it, the name came as a biker tribute to the real SS. As is the dead Indian cheif. Also a WP image of their defeat of inferior cultures. So there are multiple layers of history here that he has mimicked and gotten all of them wrong. Ha! He's just as bad at understanding his own awful racial hate imagery as he is at defending himself. Im not saying he's racist, just maybe naive and foolish and trying a little to hard to be hip.

 

Thanks for the insight, I was wondering why I had never come across that skull.

One might of course be inclined to argue that it's a rather awkward way of trying to be hip by using/hiding a well-known neo-nazi abbreviation/presumed nazi iconology in your brand name and logo.

(Dupont & Dupond are called Schultze & Schulze in Germany)
(I know, if I have to explain it, it's a shitty joke; I just wanted to put SS hats on them)

So? Guy's obviously a stand-up poop.