lol, funny thats all I saw as well

BEMON Blinders !

Personally things are indeed changing but like Andy said for the better. Five years ago making an indie toy or collaborating with a Japanese artist was unheard of. When I started to try and cross the line I was told it couldn't be done and even pissed people off at the thought.

Today the lines and boundaries are all but gone. Artist are independently making their own toys and collaborating with all major toy makers and brands. The smarter makers see the shift and have loosened up the international shipping barriers. Having a smaller shop ( If any at all) with a focus on a strong web site and social media is the way to go. Makers now have more control over their goods, make more profit which they can spend on new designs and better marketing.

Its the shops that are holding tight to the traditional way of selling are the only ones you will see suffer.

Don't get me wrong, there will be ups and downs and brands will come and go but at least now its much more easier to follow and collect your favorite line.

Personally its exciting times for me. Not for my stuff, but seeing some of my favorite brands grow. The fast and furious pace is slowing, and the back to basics of what made these toys great is back. Much better figures are being made and much better paint apps are being created.

There are more American collectors than ever before with much more diverse collections. More blogs, twitter accounts and facebook fan pages. Your can follow and speak with your friends in japan and abroad easier instantly.

The days of this particular board being ran by 2 dozen collectors running the direction of imported vinyl is over. The influx of Western collectors going JP vinyl has changed the demand and I think with the diversity for the better. Now more than ever you can collect both and that is okay, no more " collect or die" BS. American artist having their toys lifted off of platform vinyl, sculpted properly and made with better quality materials is here thanks to companies like S7 , Roto Lulubell etc. This will only help break the boundaries more and build more of a unity in the toy world.

All this change and in less than 5 years !

This gloom and doom about the toy scene dying is just not true if you ask me.

Thanks for all the information Andy.
Everything you said makes perfect sense. Sofubi is taking off for sure.
Very happy to be investing some time and money in this industry.

^^ thanks for the insight and analysis everyone, this is a thread i actually enjoy reading

Actually I think the contemporary toy market is limping along. Alot of product, but so much of it is junk IMO or just not compelling. Not trying to be elitist or what not. 2010-2011 has been kinda of a snooze-fest for the most part.

SDCC 2011? I missed one toy, priced under $30, that I thought was interesting. Might have gone for a Gargamel HP but one really had to be there, and I wasn't. That was it for me. This is very different from years ago.

I keep thinking back to that Morphy's auction and bins and bins of contemporary toys that sold for a fraction of cost. That's if they sold. Why buy at retail when if you wait it out, you can get it marked down? Obviously not everything goes to the bargain bin and gets marked down so you have to have an eye...

i have been super excited seeing pk, rich, and mw pump out awesome shit this past year, as well as new companies like ilu ilu coming out with cool sculpts and top quality packaging ... at the same time some stuff that excited me in the past has been missing like consistent interesting regular releases from sb and gargamel. and anything from exohead, gah he is my fav toy maker and i'm fiending for some new man machines or something. nag made some cool toys this past year too but all the shitstorm around that is just exhausting. all in all i am just as (or even more) interested as i was back in '07, and there are plenty of new toys coming out that i want to collect, among all the other crapola

I just received confirmation that garimpo will in fact be closing...

Although,,the same people are working on a completely new webstore

So it's not all doom and gloom...

Here's the new store:

http://omocp.com/index.html#

New King Pepora by Ichibanboshi this weekend.

To create a true collectors market, we need to offer toys at a price point that makes them affordable enough for the younger generation to actually be able to play with. That's what allows the Ultra toys to survive regardless of their pricing now, because someone that see's the Butanohana toys, will be directly reminded of countless hours of youth, spent playing and pretending to be Ultraman. It's the reason that the Mario Toys that Gargamel did are such a big hit They offered something new and exciting by giving us the oldest possible rendition of Mario, and freinds.

With Toys like Boss Carrion, and Ollie, although they are aesthetically pleasing, with beautiful paintjobs, and amazing sculpts the price point, and likewise the substance used create them, builds a barrier between them and a future collectors market (i.e. Children) they are made to Cherish, and as such, it is insured that they will be treated at such a high standard that the idea of casual loss, breakage, or dare I say custom fodder, becomes nothing short of heresy.

I think that to create a long lasting empire, we must think of the future, the patterns for success are all there and if you can't follow statistics, than I'm sure your local community college has a course on mathimatical pattern, you can take, along with your sculpting classes. The Children of this generation will be influenced to an extent, to take up where we left off, but for that to happen, they have to have a reason. Who knows, maybe "Oh my goodnes, it's one of those Garymon guys, that dad had in his glass case, when I was 6." will be enough, but it's not a sure bet. Personally I would love to see
a line of toys, made for kids...

One last thing If this "Scene" dies, It won't affect me in the least, because people like Paul, Rich, Le Merde, Koji, and Bwana, (to name a few) don't make toys for the money, they aren't trying to become wealthy, they're just fulfilling a deep desire to produce amazing, articulated, peices of Toy Art. I think it would be really hard for someone like Bwana Spoons to continue living, if he didn't fulfil his desire to create art, Therefor for me, my hobby is safe.

The reason Ultra kaiju and Mario toys are popular is because they appeal to an audience between this very small niche market of collectors (unlike Boss and Ollie). The pricing and materials are essentially the same. I would even argue that both primarily appeal to adult collectors- kids today are only aware of old Mario to the extent that he is on the Wii or hipster 80s t-shirts. I don't understand the distinction that you are attempting to draw.



There are toys made for kids. They're sold in stores like TRU, Target and Walmart. Maybe one day we will see standard size Pokemon vinyls.

A lot of people "collect" toys based on the fact that they had them or could never get them as children. I think everything I said went over your head, no put down intended, it was just ramblings written loosely. Gargamel had a hit with, the Micronaut release for wonderfest, because a lot of people played with them when they were young.

So to create a "Collector" of a product you have to have something that resonates with them. In another 20 years there will be a bunch of kids collecting whatever they played with now, and to tell you the truth if you go into a TRU the same toys we played with are being hashed and rehashed (In fact it seems like we had a better selection in the 80's). If those same children that frequent TRU were able to afford a small sized Ollie, chances are they would want one in the future. I'm speaking about that industry of collectables itself, and not just the dreams of young artists.

It's the same reason I love Spectreman toys, and Ultraman toys, I could never get them as a child (unless it was a Bandai release), or the reason that Masters of the Universe 4 horseman line is so popular. People resonate with things that remind them of youth, only now that we can afford them and they are in shorter supply, we pay more. To keep the "Toy" industry going they have to be obtainable to young people, otherwise the Otaku in the year 2020 will be in short supply.

If the only reason I was buying toys was because it was a trend, I'd be a complete idiot, and prone to wasting money. I'm in it for things that I missed out on as a child, but a Boss Carrion, or Ollie while I'm looking around, Is more than adequate to brighten my month.

Also I'd just like to say, I'm sorry that I used the Ollie and Boss C as examples but they've been on my mind a lot lately so...

@ slipstar01- I don't think the point went over akum6n's head so much as your point is very confused.

You say that the reason you collect what you do, is because you could not get the toys as a kid. But in the same paragraph you then state that, in order for today's kids to want modern toys in the future, they have to be able to afford them now.

For me, the point of these toys we collect is homage to the past. They aren't and maybe shouldn't look to the future. They aren't made for kids today. They are made for adults who grew up with Ultraman, Godzilla, etc. The way to keep new generations interested is through old movies and TV shows. And collections past down from us.

Good to hear the Garimpo guys aren't disappearing all together. Not sure about that new King Pepora though...

@slipstar01 - That's a pretty insulting thing to say about a guy who has probably forgotten more about sofubi than you''ll ever know. (Check out his blog, which goes back 7 years!)

Everyone gets your childhood plaything --> adulthood --> disposable income --> nostalgic purchases chain of thought. It isn't hard to grasp. Many people have said it before. Yet it's not the only line of reasoning under the sun.

There are a shit ton of toys made for adults. Ever hear of McFarlane toys? Spawn was made for and marketed to adults. That and countless other lines have fostered the adult market. Tens of thousands of adults go to Wonderfest twice a year not to buy Mario from Gargamel (that kind of thing is actually the exception at the event), but to line up for garage kits that have nothing to do with anybody's childhood. What will these be worth in 20 years? Who knows. Who cares.

I'll tell you who doesn't know: people who claim to have answers. Only Zoltar knows all.



BTW, I do agree with you that sofubi prices have been a barrier for some collectors. But I'd say for adult collectors (again, the target market), not kids.

If anything was said that was insulting, it definitely wasn't intended that way, when I used the phrase "went over your head" (I think that's what your referencing) It was aimed at the way I wrote it, and not any sort of commentary on his knowledge of the subject. What I wrote, (as stated in my reply) wasn't very cohesive, and from the way that he replied, I could tell he didn't get the specifics of what I was saying. RobotLovesMonster is a great blog, so no argument there.

Regardless, all I'm trying to do is have a conversation, that entails more than the usual, "That really sucks about Garimpo... Hopefully M1G0 isn't next..." line of conversation that can be most prevalent nowadays.

Terry Shoptaugh, who is a University archirist and instructor at Minnesota State University Moorhead has done some interesting studies on the subject of collecting. He surmises that collecting is based on a need to inspire recoluction. "People collect in an effort to remember and relive the past." "We use keepsakes to stimulate memory, especially to trigger fond memories,” Shoptaugh writes. “But even if memory cannot be relied upon to faithfully reproduce a record of the past, it remains vital to our understanding of the past.”

Marjorie Akinan is an anthropologist from the University of California she is also an expert on the subject of why people collect. She's written an essay on the subject, “Passionate Possession: The Formation of Private Collections,” which shares Shoptaugh’s idea that people collect for a connection to the past and memories. “Objects can connect the collector to the historic, valued past,”. Akin also includes four other reasons why people collect. The first is to satisfy a sense of personal aesthetics. Some collect to please personal tastes. Others collect items that are weird or unusual to show individualism. Another reason is for the collector’s need to be complete.

I'm sure there are other small margins of people people that collect, and I could go on, and on with examples, but personally I think there are 2 main kinds of people, 1. People that buy these toys to fit into a certain type of social circle, and fulfill a need to be included in a group of people they feel are like minded, and 2. People that are trying to get something back that they lost, so long ago (not something physical, either). I think truthfully I most likely have mixed reasons for collecting, I do like being part of the group here, there are a lot of interesting people doing really great things, I'm sure I've fallen into the hype machine of life a few times here or there, but in reality I just really, really, like spectreman, and Ultraman. Because of that I've found new companies that are doing exciting things.

As far as value is concerned, not one of the Toys that I buy will stay in the bag. I bought them for one purpose, to play and display. Personally I could care less if I ever make my money back on them, that's why I still have nothing for the "Trade" section here, I'm very happy with everything that I've picked out and bought. So far I haven't bought one piece of Kaiju that I feel buyers remorse over, I'm happy to have them, and if I ever have children, I'm sure they will be happy to have them as well. I could care less about the value as well, because to me there are things out there that are way more important than money.


I have a very cut an dry way of thinking, I don't believe in the forces of divine nature, or coincidence. I don't believe there is a god or gods out there shaping life around us. I think the human brain is mostly simplistic, and because we're human, we tend to follow the same line of thinking. I do however enjoy science fiction, and I let my mind run wild when it comes to art.

One last thing, I have no idea about other cultures, when I talk about collecting, so I'm writing mainly about the U.S.'s mindset, for all I know the Japanese could have completely different reasoning, when it comes to collectables, it would be interesting to get some feedback from people that live in the East...

I live in Japan, we're talking about Japanese toys, and I offered up first hand perspectives on both American (Spawn, etc.) and Japanese (Mario, garage kits, etc) collectors.

Anyway, Internet Intershmet blah blah blah. I want some green tea ice cream.

Slip..You forgot my type of collector.. I like to buy cool shit! I never watched an ollie show or steven the bat show or "randall the drunk-ass bear" or "weird fuckin mushroom face dude" show on saturday morning. But I do like cool shit and have always felt the need to collect stuff for some reason. Once I found these toys and realized theyre crazy collectible AND AWESOME, I knew that I finally had something really cool to collect. not some depression glass bottles from a flea market, but tons of people think, "look at this bottle, shit is sick!" I also like to collect cameras, I have no clue if theyre worth anything or if I paid too much for one, but I sure know they look cool as hell all together.

Just for your reference, "went over your head" is usually used to mean that the object of the phrase is too dim to understand your words. You probably didn't mean it that way, but it does sound insulting. No worries.

My point was that your post conflates the position of modern artist-designed vinyls and licensed vinyls. After reading your following post, I understand (I think) what you are getting at.

Don't know if I agree with the logic of making these artists' characters accessible to children so as to ensure future nostalgia. But it does raise an interesting point as to the sustainability of character-driven toy lines and their future. Most such lines (Star Wars, Transformers, GI Joe) are still pulling from the same material that was developed 20-30 years ago. A lot of this relies on the adult collector market as well. What will happen in another generation? I think we need more original ideas in the pool for toys that are marketed to modern kids to have meaningful toys created in the future, so I don't think you're complete off-base there. That said, unless you actually have kids, most of us have no clue what they are into these days.

While collecting ultraman/godzilla/toho toys today may be partially linked to my 1970's childhood (I get all the references etc), I really honestly think I just like having a shitload of aesthetically pleasing monster toys displayed orderly in cases. It's gives me a sense of accomplishment. I have no reference for stuff like Shikaruna, Zollmen, Emupaiya, etc because most of those toys never appeared in any films (books at most). The adult side of me just likes the frosting

I realize that it is fun to speculate on run numbers, but a little research will give you all your answers. About half of the vinyl figures pre-2005 coming out of Japan had stated run sizes. MANY toys were made in the 500+ range, and tons were made in the 150-200 range. Even Super7 had a few stated run sizes in the beginning if you go back and look at the ads or header cards. Hype drove some things, but it drives some things now. Buy what you like, and you won't care how many they make.

I was referring to indy sofubi makers, not sofubi figures by Bullmark, Marmit, Marusan...

If Secret Base, Gargamel, or any other indy maker has ever made 500 (or 400) of any single production figure, that's awesome. My hat's certainly off to them.

BTW, we were talking about the size and health of the hobby, not the merits of making 5, 50, or 500 figures or collecting figures based on run sizes.

PPS: I just re-read my comments in this thread, and everything I've said has been in very strong support of indy sofubi makers. My whole point has been the hobby could use a dialing down of the negativity + an infusion of more positive voices talking about what's right about sofubi. 2011 has been an AWESOME year for indy sofubi with an absolute explosion of creativity from artists in the US, Europe, Australlia, Japan... + amazing new collaborations all over the place. Hard not to be juiced with all the cool stuff going on!

I agree, we should support all of these guys. BxH, Secret Base, Gargamel, Super7 and RxH all have had runs that eclipsed the 200 pc mark and many at 300. BxH figures were all numbered out of 500 and 1000 early on. Even the very first Kaws Companion figure were runs of 500 when it was just for an art show and no one knew who he was. It was a different time. Many runs were much higher, granted there are some guys that can still make runs of that size.

accidental double post

Final post on the subject, but it's an important distinction. I believe most KAWS figures have been made in China, which, as you know, had relatively high minimum orders back then. I was referring to indy sofubi made in Japan. I guess some BxH figures (and maybe the original BxH x KAWS companions?) were MIJ, so that is a good thing.

Anyway, I'm not sure why that part of my posts needs singling out. My whole point in mentioning numbers has been that run sizes are recovering for some makers due to a resurgence in growth and interest after a couple of dismal years.

Still, when we say "makers," we're referring less and less to companies and more and more to independent designers. The sofubi world has changed dramatically in the last 12 months, with outstanding projects led by indy designers themselves: LASH, Paul Kaiju, Greasebat, RESTORE, Grody Shogun - the list grows every month. Very exciting times!

@slipstar, i'm in the middle of writing a terrible essay for a toy book and have done a bit of research on the psychology of collecting.

What i've realized is that i have subconsciously tried to re-create the awe that I felt when visiting the Japanese toy store of my youth in LA's Little Tokyo: "Pony Toy Go Round". Rows of glass cases with all the die-cast popy that one could ever want.

I swear one of these days, i'm going to buy that giant Kamen Rider that was out front all those years and is now resident at Anime Jungle.

Not trying to single you out Andy, just mentioning a few things. I agree that the resurgeance currently is refreshing. That said, I have not seen a slow down of independent manufacturers since the beginning of this movement. There has always been new, small independent manufacturers the entire time. A few got bigger, most got burned out. From Chronic, Chicken Fever, Amapro, Sunguts, RealxHead and others to the newer folks, the aount of new vinyl has not slowed down ever, but instead sped up. I think the difference now, is there is wider variety, more quality releases and more horrible releases as well. The more vinyl the better for all of us.

I completely agree with this. I am really excited about quite a few new releases, and find myself visiting the American Idols section as much as Japan Toys these days. That itself is exciting - Boss Carrion, Ollie, Greasebat and Cadaver Kid are engaging, well designed, nicely produced and, importantly, fun! After all this time I am STILL excited!

Conversely, after all this time, I am still brought down by needless negativism (and I'm not talking about constructive criticism here), collector-politics and faction mentality. People seem to forget these are toys we gather to discuss and that we have much more in common than we dont. Lets remember that its supposed to be fun to collect, learn, discourse, agree and disagree - preferably in a mutually respectful and light-hearted manner - about toys. And if it isn't fun anymore then it maybe time to move on.