Whoa!
Interesting.

Hmmm... odd. Sounds like he must have gotten flak from the Japanese guys as well? I don't know what all the bile was for... there were three paint choices, one of which was a mostly re-issue of an awesome version. If you didn't want that one, don't buy it. What's the problem?

Yeah, it's too bad. The unpaint looked great.

Given how much Nari dislikes flippers, he probably thought he would offer up similiar versions so people could avoid inflated flipper prices. Pulling the sale will probably mean he will come back soon with some new, different paint schemes on the grey base. I still think, as Nari says, "good toys will be made!"

I will bet if you emailed him, he would sell you an unpainted grey.

hmm...that's odd. I hope everything is alright.

so weird, that green looked sick tho.

Re-issues are a huge...[ahem] issue with these types of items. These toys are all sold with the idea that once it's sold it's done. I mean, that's essentially the premise this entire hobby is built upon. If things were always re-issued or open-ended then this wouldn't be a hobby...or it'd be a very different hobby more like collecting Hot Wheels or mass-produced porcelain figurines.

The way I read it, Nari-san got the feedback that we rather not have repros.
Stellar guy that he is, apologizes and scrap the deal

Nari is awesome for sure, but only one of teh versions looked like a repro - the green version was killer. Hope he decides to release it!

...I know what you're saying... And I mean no offense by this, but that's about the most repugnant statement I've heard in a while.

So what exactly is wrong with Hot Wheels or porcelain figurines? Because only a few people have the privilege of accessing most of the toys in this hobby makes us better than those other riff-raff who collect Star Wars toys and the like?

The original Marusan/Bullmark kaiju vinyls were 300 yen per figure and were mass produced. Were those who collected them back then inferior to us today?

Look, like I said, I don't mean to offend anyone in particular (certainly not you, NT). I'm fully aware that you're absolutely correct: this hobby is built on artificial hype and exclusivity...and certainly NOT toys, sharing, and fun.
That's some fucked up classist shit right there, and whenever this topic comes up, it sickens the fucking shit out of me.

I think what NT is trying to say is that there is much more skill and craftsmanship behind these figures vs. mass produced ones. So reissues almost seem like a waste since the painter already did a set that way, why not move on? At least that's how I see it. Not better, but considering the work that goes into them it seems wasteful to just redo the same thing.

I like halfsy-reissues though. The green and the red are different enough to pull it off.

I don't think anyone was being classist or looking down on HotWheels or porcelain figs. NT was just saying the hobby would be different. Not worse. That a reissue of a recent toy wouldn't really be in fitting with the hobby as we know it. (not that it doesn't happen occasionally)
I personally don't believe that most companys create artificial hype. Hype happens. But mostly because of excited collectors. And the exclusivity of some figures adds to the thrill of the hunt and the pleasure of accomplishing a goal... of finding a prize that was difficult to obtain. Depends on how you view it. I see plenty of sharing and fun on this board. There are times where hype and elitism take over, but I don't think those are the building blocks of the hobby.

I think the green version should get made too.

Yes, this was my point - different. Nothing is wrong with Hot Wheels (HW's rule!) or porcelain figures - but collecting them is very different from collecting Secret Base or Elegab. Heck, my first collection as an adult was the Simpson's "World of Springfield" line - mass produced and available at TRU! Collecting is collecting, but there are very different types of collecting. This one is based on exclusivity and without it "boutique vinyl" (I hate that term) collecting would crumble. But the common thread throughout most items that are produced to be collected is that subtle changes need to be made in order to legitimately pull off a re-issue so that the original can still hold a special place in a collection.

I think HW are a very bad example for the exclusivity comparison.

You guys can give it whatever gloss you want, but the bottom line is that reissues devalue the originals. The effect is more pronounced in these toys (versus HW) because they are much more limited to begin with. People even complain when reissues are made WITH slight changes- remember the yellow RxH reissues??

If you really like the toy, just live with the reissue and move on. Maybe there is an argument that reissues damage the image of the company since a lot of value is built on the exclusive nature of these toys, but no one seems to be saying this.

I love the RxH reissues. But what I like is that something slightly different was done. I don't like reissues full on because they're boring, value or whatever aside. I like the halfsy reissues because they at least do something slightly different and make something you couldn't get before available without being totally boring and just putting out the same thing.

Nari's pretty much proved that he doesn't care about or like the secondary market system anyway, so why should he care if a reissue of what I assume is a popular version will devalue the old one? I love my yellow RxH figures, and was thrilled to be able to get a modified version of two figures that I know I'll never find, and wouldn't be interested in paying a 'fair' price for anyway. Nari just releases what he wants, and people seem to totally eat up his style and hype-less no-bullshit attitude. More companies could take a lesson from him.

You haven't been here long enough then.
Reissues are no good.

What is this statement based on, Jeff?

Nari makes an illustration of some blobby, amorphous monster. I presume someone else sculpts it. Even if the sculpt is off, it doesn't really matter...'cause they're blobby, amorphous monsters. Someone else casts them using ~40-year-old slush casting techniques. And finally Nari (again, I presume) paints them.

The Hot Wheels guys have sculptors, CAD designers, diecasters and machinists, powder-coating and vac-metallizing people, people who design the various playsets, people who work with kids/focus groups/whatever to come up with the billion play features and gimmicks that go into these toys every year.

Hey, I love Elegab toys and I couldn't care less about Hot Wheels...and I'm not trying to keep score here, but it sure looks like a LOT more expertise goes into producing a Hot Wheels toy than an Elegab one. So where's this "more skill and craftsmanship"? Is it because Nari's just one guy? Does the effectively-one-man operation elevate these things from "mundane toy for actual children" to "art"? I presume Nari and others do this out of love and not so much for a paycheck, but that still doesn't illegitimize mass produced toys by big corporations.

And do you really think reissues are simply "wasteful"? I mean, sure, you can hold the opinion that you'd rather see a different colorway than one you already have. That's totally legit. But let's be honest here: like NT's saying, reissues in this hobby often lead to outrage because it destroys the exclusivity of their earlier release.

I think Daniel's hitting on what I'm trying to get at: I just think most people around here tend to ignore the elephant in the room. I get that these toys can only be made in small runs and have to cost a lot--that's beyond the control of the toy makers--but the pretense and entitlement the consumers display in this hobby are dismaying...

I think you're reading into things wrong.

There's no snobbery here, there's no "I don't like reissues for value sake" from me. If you think so be right out about it.

There's no "I think big toy comapnies are stupid and there's no work put into their products" either. Different. Not better/worse. There's a lot of hands-on work that goes into these figures (generally from people with other jobs) vs. the many levels of work and organization that go into larger companies figures. Different. Not better/worse.

To think that value can be the ONLY reason someone doesn't like reissues is being narrow minded and lazy. I hate when Hasbro does right out rehashing just as much. It seems like a waste of energy. IF they do reissues that have new/different elements, I'm into it. I have lots of the RxH ones, I love them, some I like more then the originals.

I'm backing out of this one, it's not worth it. It seems you're looking at it all as "art snobbery and elitist attitudes vs. 'true' collecting and toy love" when it's not.

TOTAL reissues are boring. Period. That's my stance. I'm ok with you disagreeing.

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here, Jeff, but if you look at my posts, I actually tend to agree with you. And I'm not accusing YOU of snobbery or elitism or whatever. *Your* stance has been clear...but I think you're missing my point: I really don't think your attitudes and opinions are representative of most people in this hobby.

Come on, dude. MOST people around here panic about reissues, big runs, and anything else that makes these toys more accessible...NOT because reissues and the like are "boring", but because of the exclusivity issue. If you haven't noticed that prevailing attitude around here--whether you, yourself, personally ascribe to it or not--then there's not much else to say, I guess...

I am trying to understand your aversion to the exclusivity thing. It has been part of this hobby all along. It could not have been a foreign concept to you when you started...?
Logically, I would think that when people panic because of a reissue it is because they paid a lot for a toy that was hard to find and rare. This made it worth the price they paid to own something special. If that toy gets reissued and suddenly there are a bunch of them everywhere they feel a little burned. Not that they like the toy any less... it just loses that special rarity factor that added to it's charm.
People are after unique things in all hobbies. Comics, cards, coins, etc, etc, etc. Where is the harm in that?

No big deal. I think I tokk ya wrong. On an upnote the glitter tunnel dude is nice and just showed up.

YES YES I just got my Tonneron TOO! Love him!

melek, I was actually introduced to skullbrain by Roger, hillsy, akum6n, cae, hypermook, and maybe a couple others (all TBDXers into vinyl as well as robots). They suggested I come over to get the latest skinny on new releases of character vinyl (as opposed to non-character designer stuff). Basically, M1, Marmit, Marusan, Charactics, Toygraph, Bear Model, and the like.

I always knew modern vinyl was made in small batches, but it wasn't until after I got here that I realized how tiny designer runs really are. I've never had this kinda trouble tracking down the latest Marmit show-exclusive glowie Godzilla...

Now, I've developed a real appreciation for some of this designer stuff (Elegab, Dream Rocket, etc), but the exclusivity crap has always bothered me. I mean, check the NagNagNag thread. If that toy were the same price but made in large quantities so that everyone who wanted one (and could afford the retail price) could get one, you think the thread would be 75 pages long by now?



Lucky! I came close to chasing after the glitter...but I'm holding out. So...who do I have to boff around here to get a glowie Tunneran!?