the only problem with Pogs is they lack a UE

Hi, New guy chiming in if it's ok. I've done design work for toys before.
The mold is the element in the process that gives the matte or whatever finish you want on the product. This is specially true for injection molding.
In time with the constant pressures and repeated de-moulding the surface finish will "polish" in the case of matte finish surface molds. To have the original matte finish back will require a re-tooling which is very expensive.

In answer to how vinyl toys are made: Starting with a finished mold mounted on a "slush machine". The liquid uncured vinyl is introduced inside the mold. The machine spins the mold in two axis simultanuosly.
The mold is then heated to start the curing process, then to a cooling phase and lastly demoulding. It's a simplified explanation but that about how it works. Hope that helped.

Just got the Silver Barbarian....

While I appreciate Hiddy trying something different, the helmet is really bad. mine has all kinds of blems and pock marks that it's hard to look at.

I agree with whoever else said it earlier that i would have preferred just painting it silver like the hands...

I haven't been picking up a lot of the recent releases, but the stuff that I have bought hasn't seemed bad. That silver helmet Barbarian looked like it was just asking for trouble though, I really don't like that kind of thing myself.

And on the subtopic of taking the heads/brains off, my favorite!



Anybody else see any cool hidden stuff under the brains?

Great photo!

Thanks!

Thanks!! I always wondered how this was done.

SKELETOR http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db0T26yMwOg

I love that "American" fighter too. One of the best!

Thanks for clearing this up, Robert. What I'm now wondering is, is it harder or more difficult to polish rotational molds, due to them being deep cavities as opposed to the "clamshell" arrangement of injection molds? Does that affect the life cycle of the mold? (Which could be what's happening with the Secret Base items.)

That sucks. I still would like to know why it was apparently so difficult to make a shiny round piece when Blobpus was able to plate all of their much more complicated and bumpy sculpts. Is it because the barbarian helmet is a thin piece? Or was it just a substandard attempt?

electroplating softvinyl is a gamble. When I did the chrome Ikas the factory was ' you pay whether or not it comes out good'.

Mine came out great, I was lucky.

Its also really expensive, maybe 50% more.

Sometimes, they dont come out right for whatever reason. to much solvent in that batch of vinyl, wrong temp, dip tank dirty, a truck rolled by when adhesion took place....

these toys are all made with the crudest arc haic methods, in small batches, by hand, at high expensense. Screwups will happen.

I dont think SB would make 1000 helmets to get 100 'perfect ones'. and, if you have bad luck is the only way.

then..do you scrap a 4000.00 run of parts and try again? or say fuck it and sell em anyways.

MY chrome Ika and the chrome Balzac skullman are the best chrome jobs done on vinyl.

You can take apart the Ika and the chrome doesn't flake. I turned the head on the chromed barbarain and cracks! Same with the chrome Blobpus's.

It is an expensive hit or miss.

IKe

I'm surprised the chroming works at all. I think of all of the chrome stuff I've encountered like Microman heads, C-3PO, engine parts in model kits, etc., and they're all styrene. When I saw those chromed vinyl figures I figured they came up with a new process to bond it to vinyl. Guess it's somewhat hit and miss.

In answer to how vinyl toys are made: Starting with a finished mold mounted on a "slush machine". The liquid uncured vinyl is introduced inside the mold. The machine spins the mold in two axis simultanuosly.
The mold is then heated to start the curing process, then to a cooling phase and lastly demoulding. It's a simplified explanation but that about how it works. Hope that helped.[/quote]

Thanks for clearing this up, Robert. What I'm now wondering is, is it harder or more difficult to polish rotational molds, due to them being deep cavities as opposed to the "clamshell" arrangement of injection molds? Does that affect the life cycle of the mold? (Which could be what's happening with the Secret Base items.)[/quote]

Usually a mold that began as something that produced a more polished surface will not need to much reworking. In the case of injection molding any reworking of the molds inner surface will require a sort of sandblasting type process. this is specially true for matte surfaces. The down side of this is you will loose a bit of sharpness in detail. This is usually done with low budget products. If you've ever been to a dollar store look at a pack of Toy Soldiers and you'll know what I mean. One thing you have to realize is rotocasting molds are more fragile that injection molding by design. Injection molding = Cavity machined out of solid steel block = very expensive, Rotocast molds = plating top surface with die-cast support mold= less expensive. Hope that helped.

In answer to how vinyl toys are made: Starting with a finished mold mounted on a "slush machine". The liquid uncured vinyl is introduced inside the mold. The machine spins the mold in two axis simultanuosly.
The mold is then heated to start the curing process, then to a cooling phase and lastly demoulding. It's a simplified explanation but that about how it works. Hope that helped.[/quote]

Thanks for clearing this up, Robert. What I'm now wondering is, is it harder or more difficult to polish rotational molds, due to them being deep cavities as opposed to the "clamshell" arrangement of injection molds? Does that affect the life cycle of the mold? (Which could be what's happening with the Secret Base items.)[/quote]

Usually a mold that began as something that produced a more polished surface will not need to much reworking. In the case of injection molding any reworking of the molds inner surface will require a sort of sandblasting type process. this is specially true for matte surfaces. The down side of this is you will loose a bit of sharpness in detail. This is usually done with low budget products. If you've ever been to a dollar store look at a pack of Toy Soldiers and you'll know what I mean. One thing you have to realize is rotocasting molds are more fragile that injection molding by design. Injection molding = Cavity machined out of solid steel block = very expensive, Rotocast molds = plating top surface with die-cast support mold= less expensive. Hope that helped.

One of these might fit great in someones garage.
http://www.usedplasticinjectionmoldingm ... m/2007/01/

okay, this thread has morphed alot since i first read it.
it started out as a concern about bad paint application and now is about smoother molds (which is all good - the discussion that is)

my concern is less about smoother molds and still about the paint app.

is the link here that a smoother mold will result in the paint not staying on as well? help! lol

i'm a bit lost on this too...would a new mold make the vinyl take paint better?

Lots of great info in this thread

So does anyone have contact details for these companies in Japan that produce all this wonderful vinyl?

I think the great barrier to these things is of course language and hundreds of thousands of yen

you just asked these guys to give up thier golden goose. good luck.

Yeah thats the most closely guarded secret out there. Even western vinyl companies clam up when you start grillin them about where they get their stuff made. A lot of that is because if you find a place that will do top quality vinyl you dont want the competition to find out and then flood the factory with orders and have the quality decline as a result of a lot of rush jobs. Most of the companies (in China) who do western vinyl I think do it as an afterthough they may often run giant runs of shit for hasbro or even pencil toppers,hence the 60 dollar price tags for larger pieces.

I'm only tangentially involved in the toy making process but maybe the vets can chime in on the whys and wherefores of the secrecy of the vinyl masters

hmmm.... I seem to remember there being a story about that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Goose_ ... olden_Eggs

EDIT: tavaro c/o AbelinconJR: brilliant sig!

Since it's not much of a secret:

http://www.obitsu.co.jp/

Their English site is here with some neat stuff about the manufacturing process:

http://www.obitsu.co.jp/eng/index.html