I think it's pathetic that every time I bring up an issue with another company, I get shit about Cronic thrown in my face.

That set of Zyurai Asu's represents EVERY unpainted version released over the last 2.5 YEARS, including two prototypes, which were the first ever Cronic releases. Shit there aren't enough fingers and toes here to count all the unpainted SB releases, considering the vast majority have ZERO paint and are just factory color swaps.

No, this scene is sometimes just sad. It's sad that so few people are willing to exercise a balanced judgement and prefer to walk lock-step while blindly buying what SB puts out.

I have a substantial Secret Base collection, and my raising issues and looking for reasons for the collapse in SB after-market prices, while perhaps less than sanguine for "Market Hype" collectors, do not represent betrayal or abandonment. If anything, companies should take note of what conscientious collectors are saying and take it as a challenge to improve. Who the fuck wants to work in a room full of yes men?

I may be missing something, but other than a bunch of early Bees SB generally puts out black protos, GID, Rainy Day and Chrome variations . . . it don't seem like much more than any other manufacturer these days!



There are only 3 collectors I can think of that are in this position . . . LD's fortunate enough to reside in JPN and snag shit at cost, Mr Flynn has some kinda 'in' and Muton's Mr SB . . . so he's 'gotta catch 'em all!'

Most everyone else seems to pick up what they like . . . the chaff sits still sits on the shelf like all other lines.



No need to challenge, just 'anticipate' . . . once a 'series ' or range has run its course I find it cool to see whats next! Invariably, some you'll like some you won't . . . if we all liked the same shit it would be a boring world!

Why worry about SB after market prices . . . it's outta your/our control and if you bought SB as an investment it might have been safer just banking the $$$!

If you were to read the first few pages of this thread, it was about an sb sale heads up, which went into a comment on sb's , should i say, decreasing value of some of its older releases---which graduated into a discussion on why it went that direction, quality, and so forth.

It wasnt SB vs Cronic? Or Secret Base-bashing extravaganza? Opinions and observations were just being thrown in and expressed for a healthy discussion---and in the end, hopefully, for an informed decision for some of the collectors here.

I consider random opinions and info from the Skull Brain Boards as one of my wealthiest chest of toy info---i hope it stays that way in the years to come.

sell me your crappy, inferior secret base crank bee and proto for retail.

Thank you for illustrating my point.

Perhaps it's endemic to this subset, or perhaps it's a general tendency, but there's an entrenched inability to weigh reasoned judgements, an "all or nothing" mentality, a black and white reasoning. Check your balanced point of view at the door or get the hell out.

I went out of my way in nearly every post to weight criticism with compliment. Now with parse stacked upon slight, it's degenerated into a matter of time-wasting deflecting - a pointless back and forth.

Well, carry on. I've said my peace.

I thought my comments were pretty rational and non inflamatory

No offence intended but I don't get why you seem to be targetting SB/SB collectors more than any other manufacturer. All have there share of completists, all have great releases, all have 'meh' releases . . . s'no biggie, just buy whatcha like!

I'm extremely fond of both Cronic and SB.

I don't like or try to buy everything they release but they both have some killer colourways and sculpts.

All lines seem to cool off at some point but if they release pieces that are solid I buy because I like them.

what's wrong with brining Cronic into the argument? you boast about having such a big collection of them (and that's cool, whatever)... but you start saying other people are drones and bought into the SB hype and buying into them blindly and that there's some sort of market collapse and are feeling consequences, you should look in the mirror (when you start collecting all blanks, you're kidding yourself if you think you are buying the toys just because they look cool)... or at least make rational comparisons to other toy companies whom you deem "ethical". you also need to chill sometimes and remember that they're just toys (even the handpainted mavs).

I have a thing for unpainted figs actually... they're my favorites usually:)

you do? ok maybe my argument for that is not good then. i always felt blank collecting was a sign of weakness

ha ha ha oh man... there's a whole trove of zingers that could be bandied about here but I won't do it...
</lowest common denominator>

Show me where I have done this. I have busted my ass to share info about Cronic, and that includes showing images of figures nobody has seen before. If you consider that boasting, then that's your issue, not mine. Most I may have done is mention running out of shelf space because I've bought so many. Hell, I've never even shown a full pic of my collection. No, I think you brought Cronic into this to be petty, to try to take a jab - get your kicks, whatever.

I've never written anywhere that I like every Cronic or RxH release. But last I checked, we were talking about Secret Base. Deflecting criticism of a company's practices by saying "everyone else does it" is not a defense. It's an attempt to distract and divide.

Nor am I saying companies should not make blanks. (I think they should. It's a great way to show off a sculpt, and, if made in large numbers, it's great for customizers.) What I said is many SB figures are simple factory color paint swaps, and those are some of the figures that collectors are dumping. It is the same thing I've said over and over in this thread. It is not a blanket condemnation or damning of SB but a focused criticism that has been balanced with examples of the excellent work SB does. But I notice that's always left out in the replies to my posts.

This, being the Internet, is a breeding ground for people who like to parse, divide, and attack. I recognize that, which is why I get into so few discussions here anymore. And this is thread is a classic example of the mentality that prohibits balanced discussion.

For the record, again, I have a sizeable SB collection. So I am not taking a potshot at SB or saying "Man, they suck!" (Where have I heard a sentence like that before, hmmmm...) Why would I do that? I've just offered my analysis of why a company like S.O.S. has to dump its stock of unsellable SB, and why prices here, Ebay, and everywhere else have tanked for many SB figures.

But I do find it interesting that even a targeted criticism (which every company needs, in fact) brings out the fangs.

thats pretty much saying they 'suck'.

also, don't discount people not buying from Span, due to it being Span. They're shipping overseas etc is very, very expensive.

Interpret things as you will. That's your prerogative.

I will say that, yes, when you come up with a nice design, like the BBB Obake, and you spin out - how many, a dozen? colorways or more with slight color variants, then you've created one nice design and a grip of subpar chase variants. And yes, that is *exactly* what companies that follow the platform design model (like Toy2R) do.

People here go ballistic over Dunnnny and other Western vinyl platforms and colorways. Whither balance, perspective, and honesty?

I chased a lot of SB platform colorway variants for a while before getting fed up with it. And I don't think I'm the only one with this POV.

If nobody else wants to step up and call a spade a spade, then that's fine. But I've spoken my mind and won't apologize for it.

Andy,

We all appreciate your passion for Cronic, but realize that because you tend to be a tad.....sensitive.....especially in response to any of your posts, you might....over react ..... a bit.

no one is attacking you or Cronic so just relax.

were just talking about toys. no need for anyone to get heated about that...

CRONIC BLOWS AND SB SUX ASS!

Wait, these are porno toys?

you gotta find the secret compartments for that bonus

You're completely right, of course. I was responding more to the tone of the replies than anything else, I think.

Well, let's just say to each one's own. I'm sure we all have a lot of things in our collections that 90% of other collectors and 99.9% of the general population would shudder to let into their homes.

I'll call a spade a spade, to call it any other name would be daft

I am still fairly sure this is more about run size than design.

Hey guys...there's going to be a new Rebel Ink figure coming out!! Did y'all see the post?

SICK

After all this, its still a cool thread.

I do think run numbers has a lot to do with it as Glenn points out - otherwise these would be sold out. for sure.

I aslo agree that not everything SB puts out is the greatest, but they have releasesd (and continue to do so) more than their fair share of classics.

To clear up one point, I am no longer completist on anything - SB most definitely included. Way too hard and expensive now. Plus, with all teh hand paints and one offs, its impossible anyway.

I'm also kind of glad when a run comes to a successful close. A complete set of something is still a nice feeling.

I was drawn to SB for a few reasons.

They look like cheap crap to the average person, they even have crap like pipe cleaners, bed sheets and easter grass in them. To most people a sprayed figure like that isn't "high quality" they want one they don't have to be careful with and can take some abuse and is in a fancy package.

Most people don't understand why someone would pay a hundred bucks for something because of a certain colorway or a handpaint by someone who is known by very few.

The less I knew about them before was even part of it, I like the fact there is tons of it put out, gives you options for colors you like more, lets you get crappy ones for undercost a lot of times and build up a massive small army that looks amazing on a shelf.

Why would you want to spend thousands on an army of toys that pretty much only you and a few others like on a shelf? Couldn't tell you.

All I know is this board has a bunch of people that feel the same way about it and that feeling of when you get a new figure how its the most awesome thing in the world.

Stop worrying about run sizes and colorways you think suck and companies you hate and buy what you like simply for that reason and everything will be fine.

No point in arguing about something the very few of us here understand and love. My posts on the whatever board don't count, they had nothing to do with figures