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 karma.... 
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Super Deformed
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Post Re: karma....
soda pop SMASH wrote:
hillsy11 wrote:
soda pop SMASH wrote:
turtletooth wrote:
hillsy11 wrote:
Roger wrote:
The universe isn't a vending machine.


It is in Japan. I've seen it. Hot AND cold.


And panties. New AND used.


oi don't steal my thunder I used that joke!

hillsy, I like to think I also do the right thing. and like you say, it all comes down to if people can live with their actions... but doing 'right' is such a subjective thing


I don't think it really is...at least not in commonly accepted terms. Not treating others like shit, trying your hardest to not infringe on the rights of others, helping those in need, hell...just being considerate. These concepts aren't really that subjective.


maybe so, but where do you draw the line? at your family? your friends? your community? your fellow countrymen? everyone in the world? There are so many divisions in the world that cause hate. race, religion, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, these are all things which cause people to not treat others well. Then there's greed, power, money, and these things do the same.

i dunno, i guess we're probably looking at different scales and i'm a negative nancy

The idea is that none of those things matter and everyone deserves the same common decency. There is no line to draw.

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Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:25 pm
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yeah that's the idea but how many people actually adhere to that idea?

that's my point


Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:43 pm
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It doesnt matter how many people adhere to common decency. The choice to do right starts here, with me.

According to Deepak Chopra we misinterpret the concept of karma. Karma is not "what goes around comes around" but rather "what choice can I make that will improve myself and my future". Its really about a conscious evolution, seeing possibilities and using choice to make all life better.

As far as "what comes around goes around" I can only say when I am happy inside better things happen. Joy seems to lead to more chance, opportunity, money, romance. Anger leads to violence, hostility, poverty, sickness. Shit still happens but perhaps not as much and it's balanced with all the good things if I step on the up swing.

It the end though I think its all just perspective and that of course leads back to possibility.

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Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:19 pm
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seems like I read somewhere "you reap what you sow. Let's not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up." or something like that...


Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:25 pm
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Sounds like reciprocity to me.

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Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:32 pm
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All of you folks are talking a good game about doing unto others as you would like to have done unto you, but I better not catch you in the dogpile the next time someone new shows up and posts about d u n n y s. ;p


Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:00 pm
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Good point Roger. LOL.

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Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:55 am
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Roger wrote:
All of you folks are talking a good game about doing unto others as you would like to have done unto you, but I better not catch you in the dogpile the next time someone new shows up and posts about d u n n y s. ;p


Well, noone said there aren't momentary lapses. I've been working on a much more humane way of telling someone to go fuck themselves. :wink:

Roger = Karma Police

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Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:55 am
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hillsy11 wrote:
Roger = Karma Police

He's not with the Dream Police anymore?

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Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:07 am
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and here I was thinking he was in the police, and I was being nice to him so he could get me sting's autograph.

there goes that plan, screw you roger!


Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:11 am
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Im going on a buddhist retreat on sunday with Thich Nhat Hanh.Here is what he said previously on Karma:

In order to answer what happens us when we die, we need to answer another question – what happens when we are alive?
What is happening now to us? In English we say ‘we are’ but it’s proper to say ‘we are becoming’ because things are becoming. We’re not the same person in two consecutive minutes.
A picture of you as baby looks different to you now. The fact is you are not exactly the same as that baby and not entirely a different person either. In a picture of you as a five year old, you are not exactly the same as that child and not entirely a different person either – the form, feelings and mental formations are different.
In the middle way there is no sameness and no otherness
You may think you are still alive but in fact you have been dying everyday, every minute, cells die and are born - for neither do we have funerals or birthdays (laughter).
Death is a very necessary condition of birth. With no death, there is no birth. They inter-are and happen in every moment to the experienced meditator. For instance a cloud may have died many times, into rain, streams, water. The cloud may want to wave to itself on earth! Rain is a continuation of the cloud. With a meditation practitioner nothing can hide itself. When I drink tea, it’s very pleasant to be aware I am drinking cloud.
When you are parents, you die and are reborn as your children. “You are my continuation, I love you.” The Buddha told us how to ensure a beautiful continuation – a compassionate thought, a beautiful thought. Forgiveness is our continuation. If anger, separation and hate arise, then we will not ensure a beautiful continuation. When we pronounce a word that is compassionate, good and beautiful that is our continuation.
When a cloud is polluted, the rain is polluted. So purifying thoughts, word and action creates a beautiful continuation. We can see the effects of our speech in our children. My disciples are my continuation ­– both monastic and lay. I want to transmit loving speech, action and thought. This is called karma in Buddhism.
This body of mine will disintegrate but my karma will continue – karma means action. My karma is already in the world. My continuation is everywhere in the world. When you look at one of my disciples walking with compassion, I know he is my continuation. I don’t want to transmit my negative emotions, I want to transform them before I transmit them. The dissolution of this body is not my end. Surely I will continue after the dissolution of this body. So don’t worry about my death, I am not going to die.
Let us meditate on the birth of a cloud. Does it have a birth certificate? (laughter) Examine the notion of birth – the notion that nothing can come from something, from no-one to someone. Is it possible for something to come from nothing? Scientifically this is not possible.
The cloud was water in an ocean, lake, river and heat from the sun gave it birth – the moment of continuation. For instance, birth – before you were born you were in your mother’s womb. The moment of birth is a moment of continuation. Is the moment of conception the start? You are half from your dad and half from your mum already, this is also a moment of continuation. When you practise meditation you can see things like that.
It is impossible for a cloud to die. It can become water, snow – it cannot become nothing. It is also impossible for us to die. Speech, action and thought continue in the future. The person who dies still continues because we are not capable of using meditators’ eyes. They continue in us and around us. All our ancestors are alive in us. Our ancestors are in our chromosomes.
I wrote a book ‘No Death, No Fear’. When conditions are right I manifest and when not, not. There is no coming, no going. Before she manifests we should not call her non-existing. Before manifestation you cannot call her non-being. They are a pair of opposites.
Meditating on the nature of creation and being may be the best way to understanding God. The theologian Paul Koenig describes God as the Ground of Being. Who then is the Ground of Non-being? This diminishes God. In Buddhism both notions of being and non-being can describe reality. Similarly, above and below, Europe and here.
Nirvana is the absence of all notions, birth and death, coming and going, sameness and otherness. According to Buddhism, ‘to be or not to be’ is not a real question.
Meditation takes us beyond to a place of fearlessness. We’re too busy, so we become victims of anger, fear. If we have really touched our nature of no birth/death, we know to die is one of the root conditions to realise oneself.
We have to learn how to die in every moment in order to be fully alive.
This teaching on the middle way is the cream of Buddha’s teaching. Many of our ancestors realised this and were not afraid of death.
We should be able to release our tensions. We are the karma we produce every day in our daily life, if we know how, to ensure continuation. I have a disciple in Vietnam who wants to build a stupa with my ashes. He wants to put a plaque with the words ‘Here lies my beloved teacher’. But I want to write ‘There is nothing here’ (lots of laughter). Because if you look deeply there is continuation.
I treasure the time I have left, more for me to practise. I want to generate energy of love, compassion and understanding so I can continue beautifully. I would like you to do the same. Use your time wisely. Every moment produce beautiful thoughts, loving, kindness, forgiveness. Say beautiful things, inspire, forgive, act physically to protect and help. We know we are capable of producing beautiful karma for good continuations and the happiness of other people.
When the time comes for dissolution of this body you may like to release it easily. You aren’t to grasp – releasing body and perception. Remember the image of a cloud in the sky seeing continuation in rice and ice-cream waving to itself. You can already see your continuation. The art of living is continuation. For myself and the other beings.
Sariputra – one of Buddha’s main disciples, Ananda and other friends went to see Anathapindika a lay disciple who was a businessman and dying. He had made time to come to dharma talks and weekly practice.
When the Venerables came they asked whether the pain had diminished. He replied that it was increasing. The monks led him on a meditation on the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha. After a few minutes there was no more suffering and he smiled.
When you sit close to a person dying talk to them of happy experiences in their life. Touch seeds of happiness in them.
The monks asked Anathapindika to look at his feelings and perceptions. “I am life without boundaries, this body is a residue.”
Help the dying person not to cling to his or her body. If there is regret, help them to see they are not their feelings. When conditions are manifested this body manifests and when not, it goes. The nature of this body is not birth, death, coming or going – not hurt by notion of being or non-being. I am free from birth or death. That practice helps me.
Anathapindika cried. Ananda asked, “why are you crying?”
“No, I don’t regret anything,” Anathapindika replied.
“Why are you crying?” asked Ananda.
“I cry because I am so moved by such a wonderful practice as today,” Anathapindika said.
“We monastics receive this every day,” said Ananda.
“There are those amongst us lay people who still need this, please tell the Lord Buddha this.”
Ananda promised to tell the Buddha, and Anathapindika died smiling peacefully.
Thich Nhat Hanh gave an illustration with a box of matches.
Holding up an unlit match, he said, “there is flame, but the conditions to manifest it are not here now.”
Then he lit the match and blew it out.
He said when the conditions were right (the conditions being his hand striking the match to the matchbox), the flame became. And when the conditions were not right, the flame was extinguished.

Hope that clarifies the subject!!!
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Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:21 am
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Beautiful.

Reminds me of one of Grant Morrison's messages behind The Invisibles.

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