I wonder if you new Neo-Hawaiian colorway inspired the new Patty Power release.

I knew there was a reason why I never click on the Custom Toys board...

I just saw one of these Zags posted on Monster Kolor, and I was fucking aghast.

Can someone explain to me how painting up Zags in established Gargamel camo styles, then turning around and selling them for profit is NOT fucking bootlegging???

edit: and for the record, I'm not against customizing, in general...but this is pretty fucking miserable.

Legit Gargamels...







...that people had to wait in lines for, go to events for, pay attention to certain websites for...

Y'know...actually work to get.

As the person who asked Dan to make the purple/pink zag I can 100% say that those zags were not on my mind when asking for it. He had done a killers set for me in a red/black camo so I asked him for another. I threw out colors I like and he made it happen. I'm sorry it offends you that I didn't have to wait in line, know a guy, set an alarm, get a translator and pay out my ass to get it. Obviously it's all opinion, but say i posted the zag in the show off thread and just said, I asked one of the gargamel guys for it and it happened, would you be as upset?

this is exactly what he's saying is the problem—that it wasn't done by one of the gargamel crew. if it had been, then obviously it wouldn't be considered a bootleg.

Fair enough. You asked him to bootleg a toy. You paid him for it...and I can't fault the man for taking your money.



It doesn't offend me in the slightest that you didn't have to go through all that bullshit. I've actually been railing against the elitism behind most of these toys for years. What pisses me off is that the man fucking charged $150 for a toy he didn't sculpt and a paint style he didn't innovate. That's theft.



Ah, see there's your problem right there: this isn't a fucking opinion. Explain to me with concise logic how this can be interpreted in ANY way other than BOOTLEG. I'll listen. Believe me.

And if you said Kiyoka or one of the other fellas painted this one-off for you, I'd say congrats. THEY sculpted the toy. THEY painted it to your specs. THEY profit from it. NOT some bootlegger. Why the fuck would that make me upset?

[just saw your post, Ultra999...thanks!]

I dont have the vault of knowledge for gargamel one offs in my mind. I loved the job dlux did for me on my killers set. Nobody had issues with those...I have started to appreciate zags more lately so I asked him to paint one up, just throwing out colors. I apologize for liking those colors, that sculpt and Dan as a customizer. Thanks for the heads up and lesson learned.

you don't need to apologize to anyone! this board is full of way too many haters!! I don't see a problem with dan's zag customs, they don't even remotely look like the camo designs that gargamel have done!

Like I said on Monster Kolor....

How do you really feel???

1. Gargamel doesn't own the pattern "camo". Plus my camo is a bit chunkier

2. In no way have I represented this as a Gargamel figure. I think if I made a mold, cast a new figure and represented it as Gargamel... THEN it would be Bootleging...

3. I didn't even know they made a 2 tone

4. I paint these for fun, and because people seem to like collecting my figures, I am lucky enough that I can paint them, and make a couple bucks...This is slowly becoming FAR less fun due to people talking shit...

If you don't like my customs, don't look at em, don't buy them, don't comment on them...

How many people paint toys the same fucking pattern. But because I painted something in the same STYLE (not same colors or pattern), i'm a fucking bootlegger???!! I painted 2 toys that looked like the new patty power... are they bootlegging?? Or did I cuz I took that color pallet from a 1971 Bullmark fig???

Seriously, if you don't like coming here, then stay the fuck away...

Oh might I mention, I sold mine for half the price they sold theirs for, so really who is at fault for profiting more on a colorway...

Get fucking real...

Oh yea, I forgot..I apologize...

Dan is a standup guy and I am lucky to own a very cool custom he did a few months back. These two zags are pretty freakin cool looking. He really upped his game with these IMO.

I am curious Sanjeev, when a reputable toy company like, let's say, Super7, does a toy show with nothing but "bootleg" customs, much like the ones you are slamming or similar, and they sell them for hundreds of dollars, and we have seen hundreds of these shows and "bootlegged toys" do you then consider all them and the talented artists that designed them as Bootleggers? Leecifer, LASH, JPK, Hello Pike, Gatchabert, etc... have all done customs for these shows and have sold their creations through this board and many other websites. What are your feelings about them? Bootleggers? Sorry for naming names but these are the few who stand out in my mind. Maybe you just don't like commisioned or re-painted figures, and that is fine, but before you start throwing around words, look at the people you might be throwing into that category... Including the guys in Gargamel, when they "bootleg" toys from other companies. I don't understand some of the hypocrosy some people have when it comes to custom figures and haven't we all heard this discussion ad nauseum???

-sure Gargamel doesn't own the camo pattern...but aren't you the guy that said you did something so that you would own that style? So in that same sense, Gargamel owns the camo style.

-you say that you did no represent this as a Gargamel toy...but didn't you also say that you make these toys as a general statement when really all you do is paint them. You also asked people for money so you could continue making these toys.

-ignorance is not bliss. do your research.

-if you really do this for fun, you'd be keeping more of your customs. I've sold some of mine because people have asked for them or they were part of shows. I've also done some as commissions and turned down commissions. I also have a bunch that I've painted and kept, to the point that I've told people that I won't sell it to them. Hell, I've even given away customs that people wanted to buy. I think that might be the difference. While you, Dan, churn out custom after custom and then sell them off, a bunch of us keep ours...and there's a lot more people that paint than most people know. I'm not saying one is good and the other is bad. I'm just saying the mindset is different.

-not all customs are bootlegs

it is kind of ironic to be slamming anyone for bootlegging a Gargamel toy.

Also, do you know how much I fucking made on that zag??? Do you, did you even think about that... Lets break it down...

I charged $150 + $15 shipping to China

Total cost to buyer $165....

Blank Zag $95
Shipping $7.45
Paint and supplies, roughly $20
My time, priceless to me, but who's to say.. About 4 hours total...
Shippint to CHina $22 (yeah I give a shipping break in my store) So cost to me $7...

OH I made $30.... And after paypal fees, about $23 bucks...

So I'm really sticking it to Gargamel who pays roughly $12 for a toy to be made, then paints it camo and sells it for $400...

Im sick of the fucking elitist bullshit on here. If you don't like the custom area, don't fucking come here! Or how about you go flame the 5 other newbie artists who bite other peoples styles, and they go STRAIGHT to their stores...

I've been in 20+ shows, have done colabs, have done hand painted runs for companies, and I'm treated like a fucking newjack that just picked up a 1oz sampler from MK... I've been painting toys for 6 fucking years, and it's slowly becoming a hassle, when I have to get pissed off at some random fucking dude, that cares FAR too much about what is literally NOTHING, a fucking TOY....

If you want to compliment me or complain about my toys, you PM me, I'll give you my number, and you can tell me on the phone, to my ears how you fucking feel, That goes for EVERYONE on here....

Another difference is I do not believe that Gargamel uses Monster Colors on their camos.

And Bert... I thought we were cool, we did a show together that we actually thought of, and I approached you about... And actually others have been questioning your outspoken thoughts on customs, like mine, as of late...

Yep, I said that... But I never condemned anyone from using color change flake...

I don't get why I'm always the one who gets the shit. Is it because most of mine sell? I have a full calender of commissions? I get shows, and offers to do toy runs?? Is this why I'm being slammed by other artists... Or is it that it should be fun, and I should spend hundreds of dollars paying for toys, and painting them to keep in a creepy narcissistic manner??? Why can't I make a few bucks? I was fucking unemployed for almost 2 years. These toys put me back through med school, and got me a job, and now they are helping building a home, and pay for things for my coming child...

Just cuz others have to give away toys, and I make a few bucks on them, doesn't mean I should be fucking condemned....

And seriously being called a thief and a bootlegger...

Sorry to keep cross-posting from MK, but...

Way to take it personal, chief. This isn't hate. This is objectivity. There's a difference.

1) Gargamel doesn't own camo. Yet they established that style of paint for their toys. That you shamelessly ripped off. But please...continue denying/qualifying/whatevering it. I guess your established style is "defensiveness".

2) Why would you have to represent your rip-off as a genuine Gargamel toy to make it a bootleg? Please steal intellectual property all the time...and claim it for their own.

3) Didn't know you were ripping them off? Didn't know??? That's a pretty thin excuse...but I have no way to disprove it. Even if true, I think if you're customizing someone else's toy--and, thus, profiting off of THEIR work--you probably ought to research what they've actually done in the past.

4) But you don't paint these for fun. You make money off of them. You make money off of someone else's sculpt, manufacture, and now, even paint style. That's reprehensible. If you are unable or unwilling to see that, there's no hope for you. If you claim you do this shit for fun, why do you charge nearly as much as a toy Gargamel sculpts, manufactures, paints, and sells themselves???

I make toys and, yes, there are plenty of haters. But instead of sticking my fingers in my ears and crying "LAH-LAH-LAH-LAH", I actually engage them. I don't say "fuck off". That's terrible. Whenever you hear bad news or something you don't like hearing, do you tell them to "fuck off"? What makes your opinion matter here, and mine not??? Telling me not to comment on what is pretty fucking clearly THEFT is kinda fucked: if you have the right to steal someone else's work and profit off of it...I have the right to call you out.

And for the record [this is directed more at wizeguy], I'm NOT anti-customs. The point of contention here is that rip off of the camo style (hell, even the fucking split camo style) Gargamel innovated themselves. As a customizer, if you can make truly unique pieces based on your own vision--that ADD depth to the library of variations on the toy--then I'm all for it. What's unique about these camo rip-offs? What depth do they add? Fucking shameful...

What they are, are toys I wanted to paint, THAT WAY... Nothing more, nothing less... I've painted other figures camo, and so have others. Yes I painted 2 zags camo, Gargamel painted Zags camo. That's all they have in common, except I charged far less than they did...

Simple as that... They did not invent camo, nor did they invent painting things in a split style... Bottom line.. I love, LOVE their camo versions, I don't think mine come CLOSE. But mine are also different from theirs, and in that right, both owners like them, and that's all that matters...

Oh, I guess also for the record, I don't mean to single you out, man. I don't follow customs (as I said, I almost never click on this thread). Someone who had the *same* idea as mine sent me the pic on MK...and I just couldn't keep quiet. If *other* customizers are out there doing this bootleg shit...well, that's just fucked. No wonder vinyl in Japan's tanking...

But that doesn't change the fact of the matter. Dude, you're a fucking BITER. How is that not stoopidly apparent to anyone reading this???

The problem is you're THE GUY who talks about claiming a 'thing' and having distinct styles. Then you state that you were aware of and a fan of Gargamel's split camo work. And really, if you were to ask anyone who they think of when you mention camo paint on kaiju, it would obviously be Gargamel. They made it 'their thing' by your logic. Then as soon as someone makes notice of it, you fly straight off the handle again, and you wonder why this turns into a shitshow. Your flaming and very personal response to Bert just exacerbates how ridiculous this all looks.

I wasn't aware of their split work... lol I paint 2 toys and a dude calls me a bootlegger, and a thief, so I should just be ok about that???

It's funny how others care so much about what I'm doing...

AGAIN, I apologize for cross-posting, but I think this one's important. On MK, D-LuX said I was just being negative...and told me to fuck off again. My paraphrased response:

But back to you and me--since you clearly prefer this to be a personal--you think that just because I disagree with you, I represent nothing but negativity? And here I was thinking I was defending Gargamel. Or, rather, defending one's right to own their own idea. Trust me: I don't care what you're doing...I'm interested in condemning an activity that hurts the whole industry. I care about the principle behind stealing someone's shit.

You still take that as being negative? You still want me to fuck off? Really???

I'm the one who actively wants to discuss this and *clear the air once and for all*. You telling me to fuck off makes YOU look like the one being negative.

Okay, how about this: STOP taking it personally for just a second ('cause this defensive attitude is clearly getting you NOWHERE fast). Just remove yourself and your ego from the loop. Go back and take to heart the criticisms and try to make something constructive out of it.

I'm not telling you to stop painting. I'm not telling you to stop discussing this with me. I, in fact, would LOVE to see you innovate your own style and *add* something positive to the designer toy world. I take no joy in calling you out for being a biter. I *would* take immense joy in buying one of your customs one day that totally blew my mind because I'd never seen anything like it before.

BE that artist. DON'T be a bad businessman.

C'mon man...this bullshit is beneath you.

[If that's not positive, I don't know what is...]

Both this and MK have upset me so much, and I really liked how I painted these guys... Thanks...